|
Work progress - 0.9.7.2
|
|
| Karakurt | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 19:08 | Message # 961 |
|
Space Tourist
Group: Users
France
Messages: 20
Status: Offline
| Quote j2oss (  ) I vote for 16k with 128k available as an Addon.
Same here.
|
| |
| |
| werdnaforever | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 19:24 | Message # 962 |
 World Builder
Group: Users
Pirate
Messages: 897
Status: Offline
| The new terrain looks great! I was worried SpaceEngine was falling behind Orbiter when I saw that video of the Orbiter beta. I knew the gap wouldn't last long!
I also think 16K would be good to include as default, with 128K as an optional download.
|
| |
| |
| Watsisname | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 20:29 | Message # 963 |
 Galaxy Architect
Group: Global Moderators
United States
Messages: 2613
Status: Offline
| If the 16k textures fit within 100MB size, I'd say keep 'em, but otherwise reducing to 8k sounds fine. The visible reduction in quality is a lot less than the reduction in memory.
Keep the high-res textures as optional downloadable packs. I don't think everyone should be forced to have a larger SE size and memory/VRAM usage just for a prettier Earth texture. It should be available for those who want it. 
|
| |
| |
| FastFourierTransform | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 20:33 | Message # 964 |
 Pioneer
Group: Local Moderators
Spain
Messages: 542
Status: Offline
| First of all
Quote werdnaforever ( ) I also think 16K would be good to include as default, with 128K as an optional download.
I also agree with that.
Second, thank you somuch Vñadimir for your hard work on making this masterpiece. I can't be sufficiently thankfull Love those city lights everytime I see your pictures of the next version.
Third, I've noticed 3 facts that I want adress about things that could make city lights even better:
- The lights cut abruptely on the terminator, but I think it would be more realistic if those lights ramificate and entered the day hemisphere a little in different locations (at dawn many cities are illuminated). The problem is that there is a uniform gradient that turns on the lights when you cross the terminator. The fact is that the lights of a city are turned on with the same intensity even if it's still noon. I think I can't explain myself hahahahaha
- The other issue is that these are not totally "lights". I see little contrast and a lot of light looks only like yellow color with a gradient to the grey. Nightside lights maybe need more brightness and need not to dissipate in grey tones in the outer parts of a city. Maybe I'm totally wrong.
- And the last issue is about clouds. Why it seems that night side has no clouds? why they cross the terminator and then dissapear when they enter the night side? Are the clouds semitransparent so the light of the cities filtrate through the clouds and make them glow a little like in real life?
|
| |
| |
| Mosfet | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 20:38 | Message # 965 |
 World Builder
Group: Users
Italy
Messages: 754
Status: Offline
| Quote SpaceEngineer ( ) should I keep the better resolution if planet could be fit into 100 Mb size?
better resolution is better
I'd say 16k as default and 128k as addon it's the best "business card" that SE could have now.
Quote second-ich ( ) Maybe you could use a RGB JPG and another grayscale RGB for the specular map?
this way is still missing the alpha (transparency) information I believe.
Quote Inarius ( ) performance with each type of texture ? How long does it take to display a random landscape on a random planet
I thought random landscapes didn't use textures at all
"Time is illusion. Lunchtime doubly so."
Douglas N. Adams
My mods
Asus x555ub: cpu i5-6200u - ram 4gb - gpu nvidia geforce 940m 2gb vram
|
| |
| |
| SpaceEngineer | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 21:17 | Message # 966 |
 Author of Space Engine
Group: Administrators
Russian Federation
Messages: 4800
Status: Offline
| Quote second-ich ( ) Maybe you could use a RGB JPG and another grayscale RGB for the specular map?
This is an idea I have during years, but still can't implement it.
Quote Fireinthehole ( ) Is x128 the resolution of Earth now or is it an upcomming feature?
Quote werdnaforever ( ) The new terrain looks great! I was worried SpaceEngine was falling behind Orbiter when I saw that video of the Orbiter beta. I knew the gap wouldn't last long!
did you ever use the official hi-res Earth addon? This is the same textures, with the same resolution.
Quote Watsisname ( ) and memory/VRAM usage just for a prettier Earth texture
You know what if you don't go to Earth, its textures don't loaded to memory, right? The issue here is only the release distribution size.
Quote FastFourierTransform ( ) - The lights cut abruptely on the terminator, but I think it would be more realistic if those lights ramificate and entered the day hemisphere a little in different locations (at dawn many cities are illuminated). The problem is that there is a uniform gradient that turns on the lights when you cross the terminator. The fact is that the lights of a city are turned on with the same intensity even if it's still noon. I think I can't explain myself hahahahaha
I can't change their behaviour "at different places". This needed additional texture layer (to code light switching time) or procedural texture. This can't be implemented now.
Quote FastFourierTransform ( ) - The other issue is that these are not totally "lights". I see little contrast and a lot of light looks only like yellow color with a gradient to the grey. Nightside lights maybe need more brightness and need not to dissipate in grey tones in the outer parts of a city. Maybe I'm totally wrong.
There is no gradient, they are uniformly yellow across all Earth (colored lights are supported of course, but increasing the pack size 3 times have no significant purpose). The gradient you has talking about is an lights extinction in the atmosphere.
Quote FastFourierTransform ( ) - And the last issue is about clouds. Why it seems that night side has no clouds? why they cross the terminator and then dissapear when they enter the night side? Are the clouds semitransparent so the light of the cities filtrate through the clouds and make them glow a little like in real life?
They didn't disappear. You simply can't notice them on a static picture, because they look like reducing of the lights brightness. BTW making clouds lit by city lights is extremely difficult.
|
| |
| |
| JCandeias | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 21:32 | Message # 967 |
 Pioneer
Group: Translators
Portugal
Messages: 387
Status: Offline
| Yes, it makes sense to keep the release distribution size relatively low and make more detailed textures available as add-ons, maybe with their own automatic installations; the more popular the software gets, the less sophisticated, computer-wise, its average public will be.
They let me use this!
|
| |
| |
| FastFourierTransform | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 21:32 | Message # 968 |
|
Pioneer
Group: Local Moderators
Spain
Messages: 542
Status: Offline
| Thanks for answering
|
| |
| |
| SpaceEngineer | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 21:33 | Message # 969 |
|
Author of Space Engine
Group: Administrators
Russian Federation
Messages: 4800
Status: Offline
| Yes the smaller file size also reduces the load on the file hosting. So it seems Earth will be 8k.
|
| |
| |
| DoctorOfSpace | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 21:42 | Message # 970 |
 Galaxy Architect
Group: Global Moderators
Pirate
Messages: 3600
Status: Offline
| As it should be. Not everyone has high speed internet and the larger the file size the greater the chances that those people will have problems downloading.
Intel Core i7-5820K 4.2GHz 6-Core Processor
G.Skill Ripjaws V Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-2400 Memory
EVGA GTX 980 Ti SC 6GB
|
| |
| |
| HarbingerDawn | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 21:49 | Message # 971 |
 Cosmic Curator
Group: Administrators
United States
Messages: 8717
Status: Offline
| Quote Fireinthehole ( ) Is x128 the resolution of Earth now or is it an upcomming feature?
Current Earth addons are 64k (except for clouds, which are 32k).
Quote Inarius ( ) Can you tell us more about performance with each type of texture ? How long does it take to display a random landscape on a random planet, for example, with a strong and a weak computer ?
He's talking specifically about textures for Earth and other catalog planets that use textures stored on the disk. It's not related to procedural planets.
For me personally, I think 8k is good for a default release. It gives much lower file size and memory use, and it saves significant bandwidth (especially useful for those who download via torrent, since many people download the program but very few seed). Also, I have a poor internet connection, so I am not so quick to overlook the plight of those for whom bandwidth is limited.
Also, 8k makes for a better contrast with the full res maps, so there will be fewer people asking what the difference is (which surprisingly many people do now), and it will encourage people to come back to the site and look at the cool maps that are available (links to full-res maps should be located on the download page).
All forum users, please read this!
My SE mods and addons
Phenom II X6 1090T 3.2 GHz, 16 GB DDR3 RAM, GTX 970 3584 MB VRAM
|
| |
| |
| SolarLiner | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 22:08 | Message # 972 |
 Explorer
Group: Users
France
Messages: 267
Status: Offline
| Quote SpaceEngineer ( ) BTW making clouds lit by city lights is extremely difficult.
Maybe map the night texture onto the clouds map, and have it not rotate? And maybe blur it slightly?
custom landing page to share: http://bit.ly/spaceengine
|
| |
| |
| kart32 | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 22:21 | Message # 973 |
|
Space Tourist
Group: SE team
United States
Messages: 23
Status: Offline
| From a complete newbs perspective. I think a user friendly in-game option to allow for downloading these higher quality maps would be ideal. I think the more detail the better for our solar system even if it means a larger download. It will encourage exploration when the planets look that detailed up close. That is the first place newbies like me usually visit and it should make a lasting impression when they land on the surface. I personally would have no desire to explore the rest of the universe if I didn't know about the procedural generation or how detailed this can get. I would have assumed everywhere else must be about that 8k size and not procedural. I still didn't know there were addons for example, until just now when you guys posted it. Believe it or not a lot of people on Reddit.com/r/oculus did not know SpaceEngine did this stuff, reading some of the past users comments on previous posts after they tried it.
Edit: By the way, those mountains in the 128k version look beautiful. These are the kinds of things I love to see in the rift DK2.
Edited by kart32 - Friday, 12.12.2014, 22:49 |
| |
| |
| SpaceEngineer | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 22:37 | Message # 974 |
|
Author of Space Engine
Group: Administrators
Russian Federation
Messages: 4800
Status: Offline
| Quote SolarLiner ( ) Maybe map the night texture onto the clouds map, and have it not rotate? And maybe blur it slightly?
This is becomes very complex if you know that those are not a single texture, but a set of tiles with different size, resolution and location. This is the cause why I still didn't implement the clouds shadows. Projecting is a simple and good idea, bit it is working only if you have a single texture.
Quote kart32 ( ) From a complete newbs perspective. I think a user friendly in-game option to allow for downloading these higher quality maps would be ideal.
Yes this is what I want to implement eventually (online downloading of textures aka Google Earth or Outerra). But this is obviously not easy system.
|
| |
| |
| Fireinthehole | Date: Friday, 12.12.2014, 22:37 | Message # 975 |
 Pioneer
Group: Translators
Sweden
Messages: 356
Status: Offline
| Quote SpaceEngineer ( ) BTW making clouds lit by city lights is extremely difficult.
But is it really realistic that the clouds are lit? I do believe the reflection upwards is so small that you could never see it with the unaided eye.
Love SpaceEngine!
|
| |
| |
ENG
New site
France 
Pirate 
United States 
Spain 
Italy 
Russian Federation 
Portugal 
Sweden