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SpaceX Missions Thread
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| spacer | Date: Thursday, 01.09.2016, 16:41 | Message # 151 |
 Star Engineer
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| horrible damage for spacex :(
"we began as wanderers, and we are wanderers still"
-carl sagan
-space engine photographer
Edited by spacer - Thursday, 01.09.2016, 18:05 |
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| DoctorOfSpace | Date: Thursday, 01.09.2016, 19:04 | Message # 152 |
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| Destructor1701 | Date: Friday, 02.09.2016, 03:52 | Message # 153 |
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|  I'm gutted. 26 days out from their big Mars announcement, and this crap happens. They have to be strongly considering delaying the announcement until they're on stronger footing and the news media has forgotten about this.
In addition, the repair of the pad and the investigation into whatever caused this - be it rocket hardware, pad hardware, or some procedural oversight - will set back their launches at the very least a few months. That'll hold back Falcon Heavy, and therefore the 2018 Red Dragon mission to Mars may slip to the 2020 launch window. That would knock-on into the MCT development schedule. Musk said recently that he wants to send increasing numbers of Red Dragons to Mars in every launch window, and send the first unmanned MCT to Mars in 2022, to be followed in 2024/5 with a crewed MCT.
Speaking of crew, NASA were apparently already leary about the latest upgrades to the Falcon 9 necessitating last-minute propellant loading - meaning the crew would have to be in the capsule while the propellant is being pumped into the tanks. There're pros and cons to NASA's way of doing it too - pre-fuelling the rocket so it's sitting there warming up before the crew board it means the fuel expands and you can fit less in - SpaceX sub-chill it to squeeze in as much as they can, but that means filling it up last minute so it doesn't warm up and expand. NASA rightly feels that fuelling is the riskiest time pre-launch, but SpaceX's pad-abort test seems to indicate that the crew would survive an incident like today:
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| JackDole | Date: Friday, 02.09.2016, 14:24 | Message # 154 |
 Star Engineer
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| I do not know what shall the excitement over this accident.
Such accidents happen in developing of new technologies.
If SpaceX and their customers have the possibility of such accidents not taken into account, they are idiots.
Of course they will not talk publicly about something like this.
Neither Musk nor his customers will say: "Of course, we know that always things can go wrong."
But they know it.
Finally, even with relative sophisticated technologies accidents happen.
Airplanes are considered are the safest mode of transport. Nevertheless, accidents do happen.
Because it then almost always are a high number of victims, the excitement is always big.
The media love something like that.
About the 1.25 million road traffic deaths worldwide each year, no one speaks.
Because this always are just a few. A few here and a few there, a few on the other side of the world. Not so interesting.
List of countries by traffic-related death rate
(I also did not know that there are so many, until I have it just checked.
I really do not understand why cars are not already prohibited.)
Don't forget to look here.
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| DoctorOfSpace | Date: Friday, 02.09.2016, 17:47 | Message # 155 |
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| Quote JackDole (  ) I really do not understand why cars are not already prohibited.
In economics there is something called cost-benefit analysis. While there may be millions of deaths worldwide that is statistically still quite low on overall population and the benefits for society far outweigh the cost. Motor vehicles save more lives each year than the amount of lives they take.
The vast majority of accidents are human error anyway, so instead of removing the vehicles you should remove the humans controlling them.
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| JackDole | Date: Friday, 02.09.2016, 18:49 | Message # 156 |
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Star Engineer
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| Quote DoctorOfSpace ( ) In economics there is something called cost-benefit analysis.
This is such a thing, with the cost-benefit.
For example, the fight against smoking, damages the economy.
Besides the tobacco industry, also the insurance companies, and thus all of us, because the cost of insurance must be provided by all of us.
Because if people do not smoke, they live longer, and cost the insurance more money. 
The ideal citizen would be someone who on the day dead falls, where he is retired.
The best would be right outside the door of a funeral home. 
And when it comes to wage a trillion dollar war, no one seems to ask about the cost-benefit ratio.
Although such a war, of course, has a benefit. He makes some people quite rich.
But I guess that does not belong in this thread.
(I wish these trillions of dollars would be spent on research. That would be a benefit!)
Don't forget to look here.
Edited by JackDole - Saturday, 03.09.2016, 07:57 |
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| Destructor1701 | Date: Saturday, 03.09.2016, 01:32 | Message # 157 |
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| Personally, I'm not as upset about this particular failure as I am about the knock-on effect it will have, particularly with public perceptions of the Mars announcement.
Prior to this, the post-conference news outlets were going to be saying "Despite suffering a setback in June 2015 with the in-flight loss of a Falcon 9 and its Dragon payload to the ISS, SpaceX has spent the last 11 months heaping milestone upon milestone, recovering 6 first stage boosters and preparing for the first re-flight of a used orbit-class rocket in October. This trend of successes lends credence to the outrageously ambitious plans laid out in Mexico at the International Astronautical Congress on the 27th. Randy Carmichael, CNN, Guadalajara."... or something like that.
Now, it'll be "Eccentric billionaire Elon Musk today outlined his wildly ambitious plans to colonise Mars. He aims to start landing people on the Red Planet within 10 years, but the timing of this conference - 3 weeks after the high-profile destruction of a Falcon 9 on the pad in Florida - may cause many to wonder if these plans will also go... up in smoke. Spiven Horowitz, CBS News, the Depths of Despair.
Maybe I am overdramatising the potential impact, but it feels like SpaceX's core mission stands on a knife-edge. I want to see it now, and I want them to execute it on schedule (fat chance!!!), so this is upsetting me.
Edited by Destructor1701 - Saturday, 03.09.2016, 01:43 |
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| spacer | Date: Saturday, 03.09.2016, 10:02 | Message # 158 |
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Star Engineer
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Israel
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| i guess spacex would be ok and move on. every space agency had accidents.
but on other hand the israel space agency will struggle surviving now. all money goes to sucurity now and almost nothing to space agency. also that satellite destraction means that the old satellitle need to still work, and there could be problems in the future in internet and t.v here.
the government will do in few days Emergency meeting about that.
lets hope for a new satellite plans
"we began as wanderers, and we are wanderers still"
-carl sagan
-space engine photographer
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| Destructor1701 | Date: Saturday, 03.09.2016, 13:46 | Message # 159 |
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| Quote spacer ( ) i guess spacex would be ok and move on.
I have no doubt of that. I don't expect the company to fold because of this - but I do expect delays, and possibly a slight change in culture (though I hope not).
Spacecom, however, the Israeli company that owned Amos-6, has been taking a pounding on the stock market since the explosion, and a takeover deal where they were to be bought out by a Chinese company is now expected to fall through.
Spacer, I wasn't aware Amos-6 was replacing an older bird - which one?
Optimism re SpaceX delays: If this turns out to be a procedural error in the ground-side equipment (ie, a poorly-secured hose), or a mechanical error with same, the rocket may be blameless. If so, I don't expect ground-side design or procedure alterations to delay the next flight anywhere near as much as a rocket design issue.
Launch Complex 39A, next door at Kennedy Space Centre (the main Apollo/Shuttle pad) is leased by SpaceX and renovations to support the Falcon line are nearing completion. It's projected to be ready for flight in November, and SpaceX have said they will switch all commercial operations to that pad until SLC-40 is back up and running.
Originally, they were only going to use 39A for Falcon Heavy and Crewed flights of the Falcon 9 - I feel that was a policy partially informed by a sense of veneration and respect for such an incredibly historic pad. Now it's their only option for reaching the ISS and Geosynchronous Transfer Orbit (the destination for most of their recent commercial satellite launches), and will temporarily become the workhorse pad - assuming they are able to return the Falcon line to flight before SLC-40 can be repaired.
Edited by Destructor1701 - Saturday, 03.09.2016, 13:49 |
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| DoctorOfSpace | Date: Saturday, 03.09.2016, 18:35 | Message # 160 |
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| Same video as above but with the sound synced
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| spacer | Date: Saturday, 03.09.2016, 18:44 | Message # 161 |
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| Quote Destructor1701 ( )
Spacer, I wasn't aware Amos-6 was replacing an older bird - which one?
amos 6 was meant to replace the old age amos 2 satellite. that allready 13 years in space.
now we needed to replace it. but we cant now....so we must keep amos 2 alive for more years, if it wont survive we may lose t.v connections and more.
Quote Transmission and communication services given by this satellite include: direct distribution of TV and radio translations, TV and radio translations to communication centers, distribution of internet services, data transmissions to communication networks.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amos-2
there was also amos 5 satellite that was built in russia. it was new (2011) but last year it died.
so nothing left
"we began as wanderers, and we are wanderers still"
-carl sagan
-space engine photographer
Edited by spacer - Saturday, 03.09.2016, 18:46 |
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| DoctorOfSpace | Date: Saturday, 17.09.2016, 23:10 | Message # 162 |
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| Thunderf00t explosion analysis
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| Watsisname | Date: Sunday, 18.09.2016, 00:16 | Message # 163 |
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| Very nice analysis. And thumbs up for using RegiStax. 
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| DoctorOfSpace | Date: Tuesday, 27.09.2016, 18:41 | Message # 164 |
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| spacer | Date: Tuesday, 27.09.2016, 19:32 | Message # 165 |
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Star Engineer
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Israel
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| from wood planes to that in 100 years....how amazing is that.
"we began as wanderers, and we are wanderers still"
-carl sagan
-space engine photographer
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